Kiai

[AngelaG]

Is the Kiai (spirit yell) a technique in itself? How important is the kiai?

Angela

[Aefibird]

Yes, it is a technique of itself. It's very important IMO to kiai correctly.

[Shotoman]

The problem with most people is that their Kiai is all in the throat and just a shout. It is not the loudness of the kiai which "strikes fear" into the opponent but more the intention it portrays.

The kiai should come from your hara, right low in the stomach and be an exhalation and decompression, which forces the air out.

I have recently trained with a senior sensei from our organsiation named Velibor Dimitrijevic and his kiaia is very animal-like. Yes it is very loud but it is more a roar than a shout.

Good stuff

[AngelaG]

Kiai is a weird one, because it is not natural for an adult to be making sudden loud noises - until they take up karate. ;D Seriously though, usually as a child you are taught that it is not nice to make a scene of yourself by shouting and screaming in public, and then you step into a dojo and someone tells you to make a nice loud cry, from deep in your belly, in front of everyone!! I think it is embarrassment that leads to the new grades doing a half-hearted yelp from the throat - but like anything with practice it will come naturally. So in that sense I think kiai is a technique on its own, in that it needs to be practiced to do it right.

Apart from that a true kiai can be a terrifying addition to any technique - but of course, I would never try to defend myself using kiai alone.

Angela

[Sionnagh]

The kiai is an interesting beastie... ;D

It's something which can occur spontaneously when your focus and intent all come together for that split second - how many people have unexpectedly kiai'd on maybe the final movement of a kata? And found it felt really good for the few brief moments before embarassment sets in?

Initially students need to be told to yell at particular points, and that becomes their kiai. Some never progress beyond that and kiai at certain points simply because they were told to, not because they feel it, which is also how they later come to teach it.

*end of ramble*


Mick

[Aefibird]

Sionnagh said:

It's something which can occur spontaneously when your focus and intent all come together for that split second - how many people have unexpectedly kiai'd on maybe the final movement of a kata? And found it felt really good for the few brief moments before embarassment sets in?

Yup, been there, done that.

I often Kiai during kata in places where there isn't a kiai but where one 'feels natural' to me. Sensei is used to me doing that by now. ;D I tend to Kiai a lot during individual practice of basics too - more so than anyone else from the club. It just feels natural to me (now that I've got over my initial embarassment that I had when I was a lower grade).

Angela - and why on earth wouldn't you try and defend yourself with just a Kiai, eh? ;D

Still, it's another good addition to the arsenal (small 'a', not the soccer team...). I wouldn't try and just defend myself with a side snap kick but it would be useful to have in the right circumstance.

[James Drake]

I think that a kiai is an extension of the move, its more of a finishing product.

[AngelaG]

So do you think you would use a kiai in a real self-defence situation?

Pros:
It may psyche your opponent, or at least startle them enough for you to get a bit of "playing" time.
It can make a strike stronger.
If they hit you in the belly it will be tense.

Cons:
If overheard by a passeby it could make you look like the aggressor.
If it doesn't work you look well stupid.

[andym]

angelag said:

If it doesn't work you look well stupid.

Heh, Classic!

[kenshiro]

Kiai is actually spirit yell, but it is not what Kiai means. It actually means fitting (=ai) your ki (focus, energy flow) into your strike/technique. And yelling from your belly would be the technique to achieve this. According to a sport TV program I watched long ago, you can pull out 20% stronger power by yelling. That is why I think Kiai as yelling is the easy instant technique to make your strikes strong. For example, you can see the technique in Olympic hammer throw.
But I also think masters or well skilled karateka can perform it (kiai in its real meaning) even without yelling so they can correspond to any situations.

[miffersy]

Hi,
I remember not so long ago watching a program on Discovery or the like about a Japanese guy who actually used his Kiai and knocked his opponents to the floor, without any contact other than Sound Waves. So yes the Kiai is a technique in its own right.

[Mr. Precision]

kenshiro said:

According to a sport TV program I watched long ago, you can pull out 20% stronger power by yelling. That is why I think Kiai as yelling is the easy instant technique to make your strikes strong. For example, you can see the technique in Olympic hammer throw.

Tennis players too. For some reason there's a furore every year about around wimbledon time on which women players have the loudest grunt.

[Mr. Precision]

miffersy said:

Hi,
I remember not so long ago watching a program on Discovery or the like about a Japanese guy who actually used his Kiai and knocked his opponents to the floor, without any contact other than Sound Waves. So yes the Kiai is a technique in its own right.

Hmm. Saw similar on mind, body &kickass moves. I remain sceptical.

[thingy]

mrprecision said:

miffersy said:

Hi,
I remember not so long ago watching a program on Discovery or the like about a Japanese guy who actually used his Kiai and knocked his opponents to the floor, without any contact other than Sound Waves. So yes the Kiai is a technique in its own right.

Hmm. Saw similar on mind, body &kickass moves. I remain sceptical.

You guys and gals should read the thread in the Kata & Bunkai chat section, it's called
MOVED : SEARCHER1: Kiai!

There's probably a way to link to this but i don't know how. In it, RDKI who was one of the founder members of this board talks of how he has been experimenting with changing his kiai to get different effects.

[random]

Kiai ia a very underrated and misunderstood technique. The funniest thing is listening to new students trying to pluck up courage to scram like a banshee.

I have noticed my kiai changes depending on what I am doing and to whom. It even changes from Kata to Kata, I even, like others do, add extra ones to some kata.

I am told that my kiai sometimes sounds like ‘die’ although I have to admit this is purely subliminal and may or may not reflect my mood, psychological or emotional state at any given time. ;D

As to the mind, body and kick ass, all the other masters showed their skills on the presenter, all except this guy, he used one of his regular students, and working on his theory and his ability to ring a bell (note the foot stamp) beware of opera singers who can shatter a glass with their high c.