Principles and advice

[Sionnagh]

Yes but, you can quickly learn a few tunes and learn to play in a limited sense in a short time. How long it takes can depend on a number of things including how much someone practices and who they have as a teacher.


Mick

[jones]

Agreed. Winning real fights only reqires one or two techniques anyway. (Headbutt, right swing, bar stool throw etc.) However, things like crescent kicks and spinning back kicks are trained for the purepose of the art. You probably wouldn't use these things in a real fight. That doesn't mean they shouldn't be trained though.

[AngelaG]

I don't know - I might consider a crescent kick... through the attacker's knee. And a back kick, to reap the opponent's leg (The spin being more of a factor in making it easier for linework - not an issue in a serious fight).

[searcher2]

Could a spin be another way of saying
"when someone tries to turn you around keep right on going"
?

[Aefibird]

sionnagh said:

Yes but, you can quickly learn a few tunes and learn to play in a limited sense in a short time. How long it takes can depend on a number of things including how much someone practices and who they have as a teacher.

Very true.

In the first 6 months of my karate training, my ability improved 100% (well, going from 'no ability' to 'some' isn't much of a challenge anyway!) but in real terms I didn't "know" karate - I could just punch and kick a little better than when I first started.

Heck, I still don't "know" karate, and probably won't even after 30+ years of training. There's always something more to learn and to be understood.

[jones]

Yeah, maybe some people can do back kicks etc in real fights. I have a mate who could take someone's head off with a jumping spinning hook kick. If he did it in a real fight when he was sober then he could definately land it I'm sure. Unfortunately every time he's been in a fight he's been drunk beyond belief and unable to use anything other than basic moves.

Most of my fighting experience has occured in this takeaway place called Kebab Rush. It doesn't matter how tanked up you are basic techniques like punches, headbutts bites and using improvised weapons can almost always be effective. I once got attacked whilst eating my large doner meat and chips in Kebab Rush. I had just been sick because I'd been on Jack Daniels and Stella all night. I was so drunk I could hardly stand up. A guy ran up behind me and punched me on the back of the head. I tried a back kick but fell over and took a bit of a kicking on the ground. Luckily my mates jumped in and gave him a beating until he sort of curled up in a ball in the corner. When I got up I gave him a few kicks in the head while he was curled up in a ball and made his girlfriend buy me another doner meat and chips because mine went all over the place when I fell over.

[random]

Is it I or have we moved away from principles and advice to practicality. I know one would lead to the other, maybe,\perhaps but I thought we were trying to find that deeper meaning behind why we are doing what we are doing.

[Aefibird]

Maybe for some people karate (or martial arts in general) have no deper meaning - their reasons are all for SD/practicality.

Same as at the other end of the spectrum you get those practitioners (commonly found in certain types of Aikido) who train for purely spiritual/aesthetic reasons and understanding the principles and deeper meaning of their art is the main/only reason for their training.

[jones]

There's no point training in an art just for self defence. If you want to defend yourself then carry a gun or a knife with you. Much better than any martial art that is.

The art should come first as far as I'm concerned.

[AngelaG]

I thought we'd moved onto Jones kicking people in the head again. The local casualty department must love him.

Principles:
1 ) Don't get hit
2 ) Small circles, big affect. Moving towards minimising techniques. IS Shotokan purely a linear art?? ;D
3 ) Stances - transitory positions. What do we achieve by stance? What does each stance DO?
4 ) Keep small and light. Ability to move fast.
5 ) One hit, one kill. Not that we can hit and they drop dead, but that every technique should be chocka full of intention.
6 ) Respect, honour, self-worth, determination. We are training in dangerous techniques, do we have a responsibilty to make sure we :
a ) Know what they do to the opponent (should we use a neck wrench if we have no idea what the medical repurcusions are?)
b ) Do not deliberately start fights
c ) Do not use more force than necessary
d ) Spread our knowledge
e ) Do not put ourselves in danger unnecessarily. Don't go to dangerous spots where fights are known to break out. Watch what we say. Don't brag about doing a martial art.
7 ) Family spirit. Look after our own people. Watch out for them, guide them.
8 ) Self-confidence and humility. Look to the high grades to learn, keep an eye out on the low grades. Realise we all still have so much further to go, but look back and see what we have achieved so far.
9 ) Preserve the art. Don't allow sloppy techniques to creep in as a way of life. Don't horde knowledge. Don't teach morons who may go out and give the art a bad name.
10 ) Zanshin. Awareness. Look for people around you. When fighting seek out the targets but try not to develop tunnel vision.

Some thought and brainstorms straight out of my head. Some tangible principles, others perhaps a bit more esoteric or intangible.

[random]

Then we shall aim for the middle ground.