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Post by Mr. Precision on Jul 30, 2005 22:10:10 GMT
Not just for covering your testicles apparently. The Tekki Shodan salutation has an application as a wrist lock. Bassai Dai as a wrist manipulation which would cause the opponent's fingers to open dropping any weapon they're carrying. knives, sticks, guns.
Got any other uses?
Edit by admin - AG
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Post by AngelaG on Jul 30, 2005 23:03:57 GMT
Sorry Mr. Precision, due to the terms and conditions of this board I had to remove your b*****ks. (Some might say a little harsh ;D) In my opinion (because of what I have been taught, I hasten to add) the opening move of any kata has a few applications, including the standard "yoi" position. In fact one night in a pub one of my friends came up with a rather nasty wrist lock, and potential break, for the standard "yoi". Nasty, and painful, even through the anesthetic haze of alcohol.  Take tekki shodan, you say there is an application for a wrist lock, then there is a poke down into the belly. Anyway - I got mocked out of one forum for daring to suggest that the opening move of a kata was anything other than a beginning pose. |
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Post by Mr. Precision on Jul 31, 2005 0:34:09 GMT
Sorry Mr. Precision, due to the terms and conditions of this board I had to remove your b*****ks. (Some might say a little harsh ;D)  (Crosses legs quickly) In my opinion (because of what I have been taught, I hasten to add) the opening move of any kata has a few applications, including the standard "yoi" position. In fact one night in a pub one of my friends came up with a rather nasty wrist lock, and potential break, for the standard "yoi". Nasty, and painful, even through the anesthetic haze of alcohol. Take tekki shodan, you say there is an application for a wrist lock, then there is a poke down into the belly. Anyway - I got mocked out of one forum for daring to suggest that the opening move of a kata was anything other than a beginning pose. I hadn't thought of yoi. I pretty much assumed it was the "Imagine you're just out of the pub and strolling down the street when..." stance. I'll think on it further now. The Bassai Dai one's good, especially with the number of people carrying knives these days. Grip opponent's forearm at wrist, his knuckles facing you, strike/push the back of his hand away round towards inner forearm. Just no grip in the fingers at all. The Tekki Shodan one's a bit more difficult to fit, it relies on hand movements which I haven't been taught as part of the salutation. Opponent grips right wrist with right hand. Rotate gripped hand up and over opponents gripping forearm, place other hand on opponents gripping fingers to prevent them releasing. Push down. I've googled it a bit and it seems to come from the wado-ryu version of the salutation. BTW, these guys have a video claiming to be of funakoshi performing tekki shodan and tekki nidan in 1924. The quality's too poor to be sure. www.ru.nl/karate/?Kata_%26_bunkai:Tekki_Shodan |
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Post by Aefibird on Jul 31, 2005 21:27:47 GMT
I've seen (and done!) the start for Nijushiho (one hand open, one closed) as an escape for a wrist lock and as a grab-and-groinstrike application. IMO, EVERY part of a kata has some application. It's just that some require more thought than others.  BTW, anyone got any good uses for the start of Kanku Dai/Kushanku (the hands-open, fingers together, making a triangle shape one). I've come up with a few, but it'd be interesting to read what other folks think. As for the 'yoi' thing, that's something I'll have to think about and work on with a willing victim, uhhh, I mean training partner. I've never really truly considered the uses and applications of 'yoi' before (naughty me!), but I will have a good thunk about it now. |
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Post by random on Jul 31, 2005 21:42:12 GMT
I have often thought that once you enter the dojo then everything you do has a consequence, that is has an reason to be done and bunkai from it. We generally warm up before entering the dojo and just do Karate not exercises. Obviously stretching and warm up, even the dreaded press up have little to offer I the way of application.
I suppose that it comes down to both the teaching and the mental attitude of the student. The yoi is the beginning of everything and therefore has to have something to be applied, even if it is somewhat illusive. IMO I can’t think that they would just be there to be pretty or fancy moves.
The hardest thing with bunkai of any sort is finding someone who can train away from the dojo and is comfortable with exploring the implication and applications of the art they follow.
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Post by Aefibird on Jul 31, 2005 21:47:08 GMT
The yoi is the beginning of everything and therefore has to have something to be applied, even if it is somewhat illusive. IMO I can’t think that they would just be there to be pretty or fancy moves. I totally agree. I just haven't given it much thought up to now, which is wrong of me really, as I love to spend time thinking of applications and the like for everything else. |
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Post by random on Jul 31, 2005 21:56:13 GMT
I think it is the major problem with bunkai, we look for the more complicated fuller moves and ignore the simple movements and look at their possibilities, perhaps, once one has achieved a fairly high kyu grade and especially a Dan grade then it should be necessary to demonstrate bunkai for the simplest (or what appears to be the simplest) moves in kata rather than those that appear more elaborate and complicated. Maybe by this approach it would enrich the bunkai of the more advanced kata.
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Take tekki shodan, you say there is an application for a wrist lock, then there is a poke down into the belly.
(Crosses legs quickly)
