thingy
KR Green Belt
Posts: 150
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Post by thingy on Nov 9, 2004 14:16:19 GMT
Boring thread alert:
Before coming onto this forum I'd never really read martial art forums before. I happen to also read a forum at the local venue which has live music, cos I like to try to keep a foothold on both the local music scene and some of the music scene as a whole.
The problem with the music forum is the constantly repeating themes:
Bill: Ooh, Greenday are playing in plymouth...I love greenday I'm going to see them
Neville: Greenday are rubbish
Tracy: no they're not, that's just your opinion
etc
etc
etc
I was reading a martial arts forum this lunchtime, looks like they can suffer a similar fate.
i.e.
Bill: I like doing a big kickboxing kick
Neville: kickboxing is rubbish it's not a real martial art..
Tracy: No it's not and yes it is
etc
etc
Such a pity that almost every thread seems to lower to this. I'd quite like to know about Bills big kickboxing kick, whether or not I'll ever try using it. I'm glad that Karate Resource has so far avoided this.
It's got me thinking. Posts on this forum have talked about their MA being critisized for whatever reasons. Replies are generally very protective (i don't mean on this forum, I mean on others) and of the "every MA have their pro's and cons" or the "every MA is basically the same, but just with different emphasis".
To be Devils Advocate - Tell an ugly child that it's ugly, and they may reply "Beauty is only skin deep, it's what you're like within that really counts". They're still ugly though. They look like their face was on fire and someone put it out with a shovel.
Do you accept the critisizms your MA receives? I suppose more importantly, do they bother you?
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Post by AngelaG on Nov 9, 2004 14:58:54 GMT
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! What a classic! I have been known to comment on people criticising my art. The reason I comment on it is because most of the time the people who do criticise have absolutely no experience in what they are talking about. They have been brainwashed by their instructors into believing their MA is the one and only “one true way” and that everyone else has an MA that is inferior in its self-defence capabilities, its physical fitness capabilities, is Zen capabilities, its ability to make you fly to the moon with the force of ki alone etc. etc ad infintum. As soon as these people go onto forums they vomit out their feeble thought processes onto the forum without even letting the atrophied excuse for a brain have a minute to take stock and think. Remember the saying “It is better to stay silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt”? Well never has such a thing been true than on some of the forums out there. By all means criticise what I do, but please back it up with an educated argument and don’t completely wipe off entire styles based on next to no evidence. If someone came up to me and said, “I was a Shotokan practitioner for 15 years, trained in 3 dojos throughout that time and I feel that they had these deficiencies. I have researched this a bit and it seems to be a common problem. What do you think?” There is someone who is backing up and argument with experience and research, they are also keeping an open mind and are prepared to listen to my own experiences and research. If someone comes up to me and says, “My sensei says that Wado Ryu is great and shotokan is crap, so it is”, well I would just despair at the level of intelligence on display. Would it actually bother me? Not particularly, as they are coming across as a fool and why should I give a flying fart what someone like that thinks? I enjoy intelligent debate and if people want to debate the pros and cons of shotokan then feel free. My experience in other styles is limited so I would only be able to base my arguments on what I have learnt so far, and the rest would be gleaned from research and arguments based on what other people have said, but I would also be more than willing to admit that. i.e. “Mr. X has been known to say this about Goju Ryu, what do you think?” There are no rules to this forum (yet) and currently it is getting on really well without them. I have not had to moderate anyone and I really hope I never have the need to, but there are one or two things I will not tolerate; one is infantile “My art is better than your art” style arguments, where people are not even bothering to attempt to hide it as rational debate. Does every MA have its pros and cons? I have no idea; I’ve not studied them all. Does Shotokan have it’s pros and cons? Sure it does, and feel free to debate them in a rational, educated and intelligent manner – we don’t even have to agree at the end of the day.  No one on this forum has to give their grade, style of MA (if any!) or in fact any information they don’t want to. Everyone has something to give (hopefully) and everyone has something to learn! |
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Post by Aefibird on Nov 10, 2004 20:39:47 GMT
Good post Angela!  |
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Post by AngelaG on Nov 18, 2004 11:18:30 GMT
Good post Angela!  ;D Sorry - I really went "off on one" there. Scorpio with a lot of red in her hair - 'nuff said! |
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Post by Andy on May 30, 2005 1:12:43 GMT
I think the best you can do, is to do your best. If you set an example, by extending yourself in thought and deed, then others will be inclined to do the same. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. |
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Post by boris on Jul 19, 2005 23:42:57 GMT
AngelaG makes an interesting point when she says that "most of the time the people who do criticise have absolutely no experience in what they are talking about". Actually, the people who are willing to look objectively at an art/style are often those with a background in it -dissmissing them of "not being experienced enough to judge" is oft the sign of a deep insecurity which leads to mindless defensiveness and loyalty to your style. In fact, the person defending their style is so often the one with little outside experience. Curious world.
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Post by AngelaG on Jul 19, 2005 23:44:56 GMT
And some people dabble in this, that and the other. Never truly mastering one thing, but pretending to be voices in authority of something they were only ever a beginner in.
A jack of all trades, master of none.
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Post by boris on Jul 20, 2005 0:11:56 GMT
Jack at groundfighting beats a master of stand-up, if it goes to the floor... knowledge is relative -the cross-trainer has the advantage of perspective over the single/limited art person, particularly if that single art is of limited scope (as most are).
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Post by AngelaG on Jul 20, 2005 0:15:33 GMT
Jack at groundfighting beats a master of stand-up, this is nonsensical |
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Post by boris on Jul 20, 2005 0:24:36 GMT
Jack at groundfighting beats a master of stand-up, this is nonsensical That's because you haven't quoted the whole statement. Someone who is a jack of groundfighting (competant but not 'expert') nonetheless has an obvious advantage over someone who doesn't have as good groundfighting skills, even if that same person is an "expert" in stand-up, if the fight goes to the ground. |
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Post by AngelaG on Jul 20, 2005 0:27:25 GMT
So the best thing for a striker to do is not let the fight go to the ground, yes?? That way a proficient striker will have the upper hand, yes? It's not rocket science.
Seems to me you are stating the obvious - like Shaun Murphy would beat David Beckham in a game of snooker - but David would run all over Shaun on the pitch!
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Post by jones on Jul 20, 2005 0:32:47 GMT
I agree. If you have no ground fighting experience then you should choose to fight the opponent at striking range.
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Post by malcolmtent on Jul 20, 2005 9:33:26 GMT
I've been doing judo for a fair while, I did it before I started training at my current place when I was a kid.
It becomes quite obvious when doing randori with one of the higher grades that it's not tremendously easy not to get put on the floor by someone who's good at doing that.
Isn't it really hard to hit someone properly when they are really close and have grabbed you (i'm clinching of a judo...clinch? One of the more close in ones) I see where people are coming from, I can't strike at all but i'm not unwilling to learn how to do it so I don't get my head punched in if I have a real fight, even though i mainly enjoy the sport of judo, even if the rules are bent now.
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Post by AngelaG on Jul 20, 2005 10:15:39 GMT
How many times have people had to defend themselves against a highly trained judo player, karateka, BJJ practioner or anything in a real situation?
Anyway I'd much prefer to stay on my feet, that way if they've got any buddies around they can't kick my head in whilst I'm rolling around on the floor. And if they pull a knife I can make some distance.
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Post by malcolmtent on Jul 20, 2005 11:15:37 GMT
Anyone who's had a real fight knows it's a bad idea to wrestle on the ground, but i'm talking about it as a "just in case measure"
You don't even need to be an experienced judo player or whatever to sweep somebody, first time i ever saw o-soto-gari was in the playground at primary school. People can take someone down if they aggressively go forward and have an idea of at least one way of doing it, while somebody striking may be too wrapped up in this and not do anything, or strike in time.
I'm talking more about training stuff like judo as that would make you better at defending people trying to throw you on the ground or tackle you.
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;D