Taking it on the chin...

[AngelaG]

dickclark said:

Have to ask, as I am from the states, what is, are, am?

SENI?

I did correct that but it seemed to be repeated

SENI is a martial arts convention held in the UK, in Birmingham. There are various martial arts on display over the weekend, from capoeira to boxing, to karate to the shaolin monks etc. Great stuff, and I always end up with loads of free magazines..

[dickclark]

A convention? Well that is a new one. I have never heard of such a thing. Interesting idea.

[AngelaG]

www.senishow.com/

[Aefibird]

It's a good show - I enjoyed last years immensely and will definately be going again.

[darkstar]

lol.

it's well known in all the tests that have been done that boxers hit as hard or harder than anybody. i can't comment on the ones you saw at SENI, suffice to say if they'd been hitting you, you may have seen it differently.

it is also a fact that if you are inexperienced at this (real fights) and find yourself in a situation you will either revert to what you practice all the time, freeze completely, or just steam in technique-free so to speak.

i have seen and watched this countless times, and been involved a great many times. these are the 3 outcomes and there is countless acedemic research available to support this.

discussing what you might do or not do differently on here will mean absolutely nothing once the adrenalin flows and your reptilian brain takes over.

if you think differently, just get a friend to feint sticking you in the eye with something, or occasionally go to hit you when you're not expecting it and see if you can over-ride your flinch response. you can't.

with practice you can get used to the adrenalin, and with more practice you can channel the extra strength it can give and "surf or ride the wave" but just like a wave it cannot be controlled, it's a more deep fundamental part of you than any or all the training you have done.

again, the point is, that there's little point discussing on here what you may do differently. get in a ring with someone, get them to attack you realistically (hard enough that you are scared, adrenalin etc, and not using the type of karate attack you are used to - a boxer would be ideal ) and see what you do. it wont be what you think.

after enough (typically 1000 hours minimum to ingrain this behaiour as deeply as your natural instincts) of that, you will eventually be able to modify your behaviour under stress to hopefully react like that if it happens for real.

& even then, nothing is certain.

as you were.

[AngelaG]

Wow! That's amazing. Millions upon millions of karateka across the world and yet you know exactly how each one train! . Kudos to you!


Anyway, I wasn't suggesting the boxer wasn't hitting hard. One would hope that he was, nevertheless there are IMO better ways of generating power than he was doing on that day, when I observed him.

[steelwire1]

Angela mate,

who was the boxer..was he good, as it were? Did he have a bit of a rep?

As a more reliable test, try clicking on this page mate (don't worry, no porn)

www.rickyhitmanhatton.com/video/video.html

its a well known decent boxer but he definately has that hunched over stance. What do you think of his power production? compared to karate I mean..

Personally I think its well off compared to chow gar mantis, haha, crystal.

Nice one,

Steve

'chow gar family student wef 1985'

[maskedman]

When you punch someone, you get your power through your feet, up your legs and through your hips. When you move around on the balls of your feet, make sure you put your feet on the ground before you throw a punch. You will get about 60% more power guaranteed.

Keeps these things in mind to execute a proper boxing stance.
Keep your chin down. You'll hear this alot.
Keep your teeth slightly clenched. If you get hit, keeping your mouth closed will better your chance of not getting knocked out. And you're less likely to lose any teeth.
Keep your feet shoulder width apart. If you have have too wide of a stance, your mobility will be limited. You will not be able to move quickly. If your feet are too close, you will be off balanced.
Keep your elbows close to your body. This protects your body and saves you energy, because you are not wasting any energy holding your elbows up.
Keep your hands up. This will allow you to pick off (block & parry) punches. The left hand should be held slightly out.
Keep your knees slightly bent.
Keep your hands up...
Here's the truth about boxing; YOU'RE GOING TO GET HIT. You can decrease your chances of getting hit by learning some defensive maneuvers. Parries, shielding, shoulder-rolls, slipping, and weaving. These techniques need to be implemented into your fighting style if you expect to have any success as a fighter. Let's start with the most basic defensive move; the shield.


Shielding, commonly known as blocking, is simply using your arm to absorb the blows delivered by your opponent. Shielding is best used against hooks, overhands, and wild punches.

I think the shielding/weaving is why the body is hunched, a boxers body is not tense, but relaxed, tension would lead to wasted energy!

As for keeping the chin tucked in that is always a good idea, as it is the most common area that an assailant aims for...buying into the myth that if you hit the chin he will collapse everytime!

I use the boxers method of fighting...I find it works better than the head high stance of Eastern MA...because once you get inside the MAs stance they are unprotected. Once inside a boxers stance they have there chin tucked away nicely!

*bows respectfully*

[steelwire1]

H2Whoa mate, thats an interesting viewpoint...especially coming from a karateka, so to speak.

How are you a karate guy mate if you choose to fight just like a boxer. Surely you are a boxer instead.

Also I think you are ignoring the very intelligent views of Angela and Aefibird here. They have seen boxers, with their own eyes...and they say there is no power due to the stance...a karate stance is better, as it were, according to them. Crystal clear.

Nice one,

Steve

'chow gar family student wef 1985'

[AngelaG]

steelwire1 said:

H2Whoa mate, thats an interesting viewpoint...especially coming from a karateka, so to speak.

How are you a karate guy mate if you choose to fight just like a boxer. Surely you are a boxer instead.

Also I think you are ignoring the very intelligent views of Angela and Aefibird here. They have seen boxers, with their own eyes...and they say there is no power due to the stance...a karate stance is better, as it were, according to them. Crystal clear.

Nice one,

Steve

'chow gar family student wef 1985'

LOL, that's not what I said, as you well know. I said that I saw A boxer who was so tensed up he was losing a lot of power. Maybe he just wasn't very good??

[maskedman]

steelwire1 said:

H2Whoa mate, thats an interesting viewpoint...especially coming from a karateka, so to speak.

How are you a karate guy mate if you choose to fight just like a boxer. Surely you are a boxer instead.

Also I think you are ignoring the very intelligent views of Angela and Aefibird here. They have seen boxers, with their own eyes...and they say there is no power due to the stance...a karate stance is better, as it were, according to them. Crystal clear.

Nice one,

Steve

'chow gar family student wef 1985'

I am noy a karateka, I am a fighter, there is a difference in what I do and angela and aefibird do. I am just your standard MMA practitioner and I do what is best for me!

You shouldnt put there views down, perhaps advise them to take one boxing class and see if their views change...if not allow what works for them, to be that !

*bows respectfully*

[steelwire1]

Haha Angela mate, you're pretty sharp. Crystal.

Aefibird did say this: "To me, the current hunched-over type position would seem to limit available power, rather than enhance it. Evolution of learned errors? Maybe, but I don't see any evolution in a position which restricts power flow"

so she obviously thinks boxing stance reduces power..I tend to agree, as it were. What do you think Angela? What you have said so far makes it sound like you agree with Aefibird.

Have a look at some of the videos of Hatton that I posted up mate. Crystal clear.

Nice one,

Steve

'chow gar family student wef 1985'

[Aefibird]

steelwire1 said:

Also I think you are ignoring the very intelligent views of Angela and Aefibird here. They have seen boxers, with their own eyes...and they say there is no power due to the stance...a karate stance is better, as it were, according to them.

I never said a karate stance was better - nor did I stay a boxing stance was bad. I was referring to any stance that prevents the transfer of power - be that boxing, karate, TKD, Wing Chun, whatever. A poor stance is a poor stance, regardless of the martial art. There are poor students of boxing just as there are poor students of karate.

[darkstar]

do you suppose many schools giving demonstrations or exhibition fights at SENI would allow bad embassadors of their disciplines to represent them there?

[steelwire1]

Haha, with all respect Aefi, the first page of this thread was all about why modern boxing stance is bad and how they should stand more upright. I happen to agree with you, but why have you and Angela suddnly clammed up on this issue, as it were?..come on, you are amongst like minded MA's here, and I for one would be very keen to hear what you have to say on this subject.

Don't tell me you are afraid of Kev now are you? Although he does make a good point about SENI, haha. Crystal clear mate, so to speak.

Here is where you say the current boxing stance is bad:

"To me, the current hunched-over type position would seem to limit available power, rather than enhance it. Evolution of learned errors? Maybe, but I don't see any evolution in a position which restricts power flow"

Nice one,

Steve

'chow gar family student wef 1985'